WXYZ Detroit discussing series on ID on 2/18 and 2/19


How interesting this will be in comparison/contrast to the footage on WDIV’s look into the child killings.  Glad people went on the record.

33 Comments on “WXYZ Detroit discussing series on ID on 2/18 and 2/19”

  1. bitamoney says:

    When the killings were fresh in the news law enforcement circulated the famous drawing of a perpetrator, the one with dark long hair, a long face and a large nose. Who could have that been? Could Arch Sloan have looked like that at the time? It wasn’t Busch.

  2. 788 says:

    It’s good that these documentaries have renewed public interest in the case. After watching all 6 hours of the WDIV production I found it very well done. It gives historical perspective on what it was like in 1976 -1977. It looks like the Investigative Discovery production will dig deeper into the current status of suspects and evidence. Kudos to Kevin Deitz and Heather Catallo for investing in this case.

    It’s good one main fact was addressed: The blue Gremlin – this distraction has finally been clarified and hopefully now the public can consider the Le Mans or Bonneville as main suspect vehicles. Maybe someone will remember a potential suspect or person of interest that they excluded back then all because they did not have a blue Gremlin.

    I also found it horrible that Jill Robinson was depicted as the “runaway girl” in the press at the time. It must have been devastating to her parents.

    • cathybroad says:

      The runaway designation broke my heart.

    • Jennifer Grinder says:

      I have left Kevin Dietz several messages about a serious tip I have not once has he ever contacted me I have grave info to tell but everyone is determined that it’s this stupid sex ring

      • 788 says:

        If you have a tip I would recommend using the tip line for the case as well as contacting the media (833)784-9425. Time is of the essence in this case. I agree that the sex ring aspect is getting a lot of attention, but that would be difficult to prove without uncovering photos or videos of the victims. An Occam’s Razor approach.

        • cathybroad says:

          Yes, 788. I am going to post about this. Time is of the essence indeed. The Investigation Discovery show “Children of the Snow” airs tonight and tomorrow night. That will give exposure to the case much more widely than just metro Detroit. Tips are going to flow in and this is the last time anybody’s going to look at them. The Fox Island sex ring is relevant to explain how Michigan gave pedophile Frank Shelden a pass–my god, the Detroit area news hardly touched this story back in the day–but it is mostly a great way to sell books and shows. Occam’s Razor always applies in any situation. Do not make unnecessary assumptions and the answer to a problem is often the simplest. “One should not increase, beyond what is necessary, the number of entities required to explain anything.”

    • Judi Coltman says:

      788- As a member of LE did you notice in Part 4 that David Robertson says his father brought home tips, put them on the table and asked his boys to go through them and see if there was anything he should look into? I believe young Robertson’s response was a small laugh and, ‘We didn’t see shit.” My question: Is that even close to normal investigative behavior???? Because I thought my head was going to explode.

      • 0788 says:

        Yes, absolutely, that made me cringe. Seemed like his father was swamped with an enormous amount of tips and his job was to review them. What if a valid tip was evaluated and dismissed by the teens? I did not see the humor in such a serious subject.I feel the tips should be available for viewing through the MSP Archives. Enough time has elapsed in the case, I doubt anyone is going to file a lawsuit. Sometimes people not directly involved can see things that professionals can’t. Appelman did just that. You don’t need a degree in Criminal Justice to review evidence and ask questions. The more eyes looking at the case the better, but not like Robertson did.

  3. jkaneh says:

    Heather is one of the most thorough investigative journalists I have met. She did a story on our case and she went further than any other ones we worked with. I wish she could get interviews with those old men sitting in prison refusing to talk.



    • Jennifer Grinder says:

      I have left Kevin Dietz several messages about a serious tip I have not once has he ever contacted me I have grave info to tell but everyone is determined that it’s this stupid sex ring

  4. Becca says:

    Has there ever been a photo of a beardless Christopher Busch? The one composite sketch looks just like Gregory Greene with his longer hair & no glasses. Is there a website that has a photo of John McKinney and a picture of the rope art that was taken from his studio?

    • cathybroad says:

      Yes, it does look like Greg Green. But the cops will tell you he was incarcerated on March 16, 1977. That when he was arrested on the charges in Flint, he remained in custody until he was sentenced months later. Have never seen a photo of Busch without a beard. But he would have been really noticeable because he was fat back when there were not so many fat people walking around. There is a photo of McKinney from The Birmingham Observer and Eccentric in December of 1977. It is in a summary of the year’s news and McKinney’s photo is right next to Tim’s. At one point, on one of the online forums, someone mentioned the artist who made the rope art and I found some of her examples online. It will take me some time to find these documents to post.

  5. Joe says:

    I am so happy that, along with your family and the other victims’ families, Investigation Discovery, Marney Keenan, Kevin Dietz, and Heather Catallo continue to keep this case alive. I was around 9 or 10 at the time of the killings and living in the area. Seeing those composite sketches still illicits fears in my 50 year old mind that I have never forgotten and probably never will. As the Golden State Killer case taught us in April, this case WILL be solved. What continues to bother me is the corruption, cover-ups, and lies coming out of that sleazy Oakland County Prosecutor’s office. How is Jessica Cooper still employed? How did Brooks Patterson get re-elected all those years? God Bless your family and especially your father. I pray for a resolution and justice so he may live out the rest of his days in peace knowing he found justice for his son.

  6. Judi Coltman says:

    Artist of rope hanging was Jane Knight of Birmingham.

  7. Patty L says:

    Have they ever shared the list with your family? And if so was there any other possible connections to the Fox Island participants or Catholic churches or employees of same around these areas?

  8. susan says:

    Shelden Family connections and power in Detroit.


  9. 0788 says:

    I have a question regarding”Children of the Snow” on Investigative Discovery (Episode 3 – Uncovered). I notice that at about 5 minutes into the episode Cory Williams states that immediately after Mark Stebbins was found “Southfield PD processed the suspect’s car”. This would have been before Jill Robinson’s abduction 10 months later. He do not say who the suspect/owner of the car that was processed was. I would guess Sloan?

  10. bitamoney says:

    After watching all five segments of the locally produced series on the OCCK I found myself stepping back just a bit in an analytical mode. I started thinking about WHAT the problem is here with bringing this investigation to a conclusion. Could it be the most banal thing of all, money? Or loss of it? I’m not a lawyer. But interestingly, nearly all the people who are at odds about this are lawyers. Mr. King, Cathy King, Jessica Cooper, the various prosecutors in the various counties and their assistant prosecutors, the lawyers representing the two polygraphers, even the Kings themselves have lawyers. So, I’m wondering, as I hear Mr. King explain that Christopher Busch was questioned, tested and released BEFORE Tim was murdered, are the government lawyers just eternally deceptive about this case, and refusing to reveal all in an attempt to avoid a huge ultra million dollar lawsuit brought by the Kings, who can claim some kind of incompetence on the part of LE. Because they let Busch go? I’m not a lawyer, as I say. So I do not know if a suit can even be brought against local MI gov’t. But could this be the bottom reason for all the michigasse (craziness?)
    And on a personal note I have to tell you that Oakland County Prosecutor Jessica Cooper just makes my stomach turn. When she has the gall to say ever so kindly , with a tiny smile, that Mr. King forgets things sometime. I just wanted to…..she disgusts me.
    Then again, Detroit has been a corrupt place for a long, long time.

    • 0788 says:

      Totally agree. She has her prepared statement – that her job is “to prosecute LIVING people”. On the other hand she does not have the guts to say she has given up on the case. All the while her yes man, Paul Walton carries her line. The investigation appears to have had several gaffes that may have resulted in the suspect being allowed back into thee public. This is something that any law enforcement agency despises. Bad press is to avoided at all costs.

      Aside from that, my heart goes out to the families who must feel such sadness and frustration. God bless you.

  11. bitamoney says:

    Oh yeah. Meant to mention that there are several moments in the 5 part series where “evidence”, photos, quotes etc come up but then are never followed up by explanations as to relevance. For example, it is mentioned that white dog hairs are among the forensic items found. But they fail to mention that Busch had a little white Highland terrier. Pretty important, no? Couldn’t that little dog have played a big part as a lure? “Help me hold the dog so we can go to the vet”, or some such entreaty.
    Also, how many times (about 15) did the series show the police sketch of the long faced, long haired man? But did they cough up a photo of Arch Sloan as a young man? Did the show try to associate the drawing with any suspect? No. But Sloan’s face is the only one that had a resemblance. Why didn’t they cut from a face to a drawing and back to the face? They didn’t have to be verbally incriminating.
    Why isn’t Arch Sloan being brought into a grand jury to testify?

    • B says:

      You make so many valid points. They should have shown side by sides. The one sketch looks just like Gregory Greene. They also should have brought up the fact that Chris Busch had a Chevy Vega that was blue & had the white hockey stripes bearing a strong resemblance to a Gremlin. It’s disappointing how bad the State Police dropped the ball on listing the correct suspected vehicles after all the time and effort that went into that portion of the investigation. Also, Robertson’s (the guy in the red t shirt on the WDIV pod cast) his behavior is petty and u professional. Sigh……

  12. B says:

    While watching Part 3 of the WDIV podcast, while the reporter is interviewing the homeowner in the ditch on Gill Rd, ironically there is a blue car with a hockey stick in frame 24:44. My iPhone isn’t sophisticated enough for me to frame & snapshoot the car as the camera pans fast. Just thought I’d make people aware.

  13. l.h. says:

    Hi all,

    There are so many details that I know as I was almost kidnapped by the occk, I am so frustrated, the questions that I have are why did the occk change his area to kidnap to Lake Orion, Mi?????
    Did any of the suspects have any connection to Lake Orion? I have a hard time believing that they just picked it.
    I and another girl were almost kidnapped by the occk, we know a lot and he really did have a gremlin car that he used, it is so possible he changed cars but we were forsure almost kidnapped in a gremlin, and it was not blue it was green, they must have painted it so the police would be only looking for a blue one it did have the stripes everyone reported.
    I stared the occk in the face as he pulled my arms to him, I know my attempted kidnapping is on police file, and I know the description of him, but this is a detail you have not heard in any documentary, whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy?
    I don’t remember the exact date of my attempted abduction, but I do know there were no more kidnappings after that, he now could be identified. I am sure this timeline will help to catch occk, like who was in prison at this time and who wasn’t.
    Did Bush die before or after this timeline, I am sure that our attempted kidnapping is the key to the closure, now if they would get off their dead beat butts and figure it out.
    Our attempted kidnapper matches arch sloans younger description, I don’t think I can forget that perfect triangle nose and those light color eyes staring at me as I pulled both of us free from him
    Shame on you MSP, you are a bunch of fools, you had hair dna,you had mine and the other girls description way back then, and what did you do with it you sat on it so long, you all are responsible for sitting on it, and you are just as responsible for the murders of these children as the murderers themselves, to hold back anything that would help this case watch out your day is coming in court the court that matters the judgement court, God’s court, you may have hidden it from all of us, but you have hid nothing from the Heavenly Father, you all have gotten away with nothing I hope it was worth it to you all.

    • Are you still in southeast Michigan? This is the first I’ve heard of the Orion connection. I live in Oxford at the time I’m currently working on a video from my YouTube channel about how the County County case affected young people back in the day. Feel free to reach out to me if you’d be interested to talk about your experience either on camera or off totally whatever you’re comfortable with.

  14. stillhere says:

    I have been thinking this entire time, the father Busch was involved. He wasn’t a stupid man and high profile for sure. Could a cop and the father have accepted big Chris needed to go since he was bringing all of the eyes to them? That father doesn’t sound like the man who would allow a shoddy staged suicide to go without investigation and charges unless he was ok with it. Suicide was considered an embarrassment on the family as well back then.

    Has anyone considered the housekeepers at Busch’s doing the pristine laundering of the clothes? Those housekeepers can be fiercely loyal and may be set up for life to keep their mouth shut.
    Something that could be dug into as far financial evidence, large sums of money paid to the help around those times? They made a point of mentioning the housekeeper worrying about Jr. since she couldn’t get in the door. Just some things that came to mind for me. All that documentation shredded and no mention of him in the father’s obituary speaks volumes of how DONE they seem to have been with public perv Chris. Everyone completely fearful of speaking up, even when offered unbelievable deals is proof they know how far reaching this group is. If you kill or allow your own son to be killed, that message is loud and clear the lengths these elitists could be willing to go if you are who put them in the crosshairs.

    I hope you and your family get some peace. Thank you for speaking up for all of the voiceless innocent children used by these animals. It is a time when busting pedos is trending!

    • B says:

      That is a strange obituary. No photo and a serious type-o that Elsie Busch (The Grandmother) was listed as the girlfriend. 🤔 More things that don’t add up.

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