If you have any information or even suspicions, PLEASE call the tip line at 833-784-9425. I’m sure the police can keep your name out of any discussion they have with a suspect or his family and associates. One of my readers made the point that time is of the essence. Act while there are still momentum and pressure in these cases. This is probably it.
Call the tip line even if you have spoken to police multiple times before. Posting here or emailing me just adds another step to the process. Tonight the Investigation Discovery show “Children of the Snow” airs. It is a four hour series airing tonight and tomorrow night. The case will get world-wide exposure, not just in metro Detroit.
Nothing I say to police will advance your lead. You have to get up the courage and call the tip line. If you don’t hear back, then you can email me and I will put you in touch with other documentarians working on this case. I don’t have police powers. I can’t research your lead. I don’t have access to police files. I only have access to the $11,000 worth of redacted documents the Michigan State Police deemed compliant with FOIA requests. I have no sway with police. The necessity of this blog has ensured that.
Whoever did this has had his lived his life for over 40 years with no repercussions. His family has been able to move on without any repercussions. Was it not obvious in the WDIV series what this has done to the families of the victims in this case? Get your shit together and call the tip line. Don’t email me about how you know people in Michigan who killed kids and fed them to their dogs. What am I supposed to do with that information?
A couple of readers have mentioned that Fox Island is muddying the waters here. Probably so. Frank Shelden and Fox Island sell books and shows. I do think it is relevant as background for how the Detroit area law enforcement and media handled situations involving people with money and put men who were criminals ahead of children. While the Traverse City Record-Eagle was publishing a multi-part investigative series about Shelden and Fox Island in 1976-1978, the Detroit area media hardly touched it. And it WAS relevant to the general discussion at the time because it was going on at the same time the OCCK was hunting kids. But the MSP and Oakland County controlled the narrative. And that narrative helped keep the case from ever being solved.
But why not take a page from the two courageous men who described going to Fox Island back in the day as boys? They were filmed constantly while they “skinny dipped,” and one of them was physically violated. They spoke on camera. IF THEY CAN DO THIS, YOU CAN LEAVE A TIP IN THE OCCK CASE ON A RECORDED PHONE LINE.
DNA technology is constantly evolving. The needle in the haystack is easier to find if there is a name. Thus far the source of the DNA in this case is not in any data base or police files. This case has been unfairly elevated to one where only DNA will be accepted as a way to solve the case. Give police a name so we can get over this hurdle.
Busch–total slob and monied, worthless fat fuck. I agree, a kid probably wouldn’t go with him. But the fact is he approached many kids–males and females, and raped many boys. Lots of people also saying that the Busch lead derailed the investigation. Again–look at the larger theme. If he wasn’t involved, why did someone murder him and try to frame him as the OCCK? Why didn’t the prosecutor pick up the phone and tell the families about this back in the day? That answer is obvious. H. Lee Busch was going to make sure that never happened. But what did happen? Over the decades, cops mentioned this suspect–the son of a wealthy GM exec–to people on the street. It came up in conversations in bars and in stores. The name bubbled to the surface again in 2006–of course it eventually did. Officials would gladly talk about David Norberg, Ted Lamborgine and many other potential suspects in the press, but Busch and Green? No way! Something really stinks in this investigation and I hope that becomes more obvious after the ID show airs. Misfeasance or malfeasance? See for yourself. Either way, it didn’t work out for Mark, Jill, Kris and Tim.
Tonight and tomorrow the case will reach a worldwide audience. But in a few weeks, this will all die down and go away. Oakland County is banking on that. SO PICK UP THE PHONE AND CALL IN YOUR INFORMATION EVEN IF YOU HAVE SPOKEN TO POLICE BEFORE. 833-784-9425.
Forgive me for asking what is probably a stupid question, but you never know with the LE in this case.
Do the police have DNA samples from Green, Hastings, Moore, and all the other people that have been questioned (many of which are dead)? I cannot believe that Busch’s death is listed as suicide- it totally looks so staged.
Great Post Cathy, I pray for you, your family and all of the familes that this case is finally solved. I think the North Fox island piece is interesting but, my opinion is that is doesnt have much to do with the OCCK. Can I ask a question, being 12 years old at the time and the killings happening right around me in Southfield, I like every other kid at the time will never forget that time period. Throughout the years, I have read every book, article, blog, website that I could get my hands on about this case. Why was John Hastings never truly investigated? It sure seems crazy that he lived so close to Busch and apparently knew so much about the killings at a time when none of the information was released to the public? Thanks so much Cathy, all the best and I am praying. Your father is a hero to me and many people.
Jeremy
Thanks, Jeremy. Here’s my take on Hastings. The tip was called in by Helen Dagner. Helen has since died, but she gave the cops a run for their money. They hated her. She could be an utterly awful person–but I still admired her tenacity. She put her information online long, long before the first podcast or online forum. I admired that greatly. The Birmingham police investigated John Hastings in 1992 or so. They got nowhere. Hastings was interviewed in Atlanta by Cory Williams and Gary Gray after the Lamborgine lead. He provided a DNA sample to the Georgia Bureau of Investigation. He agreed to, but to my knowledge never took, a polygraph after his most recent interview. Again, I think the Hastings tips were discounted because of Helen’s hostile relationship with the MSP. I had an old friend, a retired police chief, look at everything online about John Hastings in 2006. He said this: Someone can be crazy and still be right.
If people really understood how these tips are really approached and how, after all these years, it’s really hard to connect the dots, they would be appalled. Hastings shows up to his interview in Atlanta with some fucking serial killer encyclopedia book, tells officers he’s just a simple old serial killer buff. When the DNA doesn’t hit, they are done with him. I still credit Helen Dagner, as awful as she was to me in the end, with making me realize how fucked this investigation has always been.
By the way, when we got the Busch name in 2006, I contacted police to point out that John Hastings lived on Tuckahoe Road in Bloomfield Village, right around the corner from the Busch home on Morningview Terrace. Two men in their late 20’s still mooching off mom and dad (Hastings lived in a house owned by his parents, next door to their house and Busch still had a bedroom and was found dead in his parents house). Check out a Google map of that little Shangri-La called Bloomfield Village and look at the streets Tuckahoe Road and Morningview Terrace. But Hastings tells police he’s never heard of Chris Busch. Nope.
Richard Hojnacki was another freak in his late 20’s living in a nice suburb of Detroit, in his parent’s basement, who also committed “suicide” in 1977. I have to believe selling kids was more lucrative than selling drugs. But all this stuff about the Village? Just a coincidence. Nothing to see here.
Oh, and John’s younger brother Mike worked at John McKinney’s art gallery while he was in high school. Such a small world, isn’t it?
Having invested a lot of years, hope and ultimately angst with Helen, I’d like to weigh in. I, too, credit Helen for ushering these cases into the digital age. In the early 2000s when I was searching for an avenue and validation for my small portion of Tim’s case, Helen had posted her experience with Hastings (then unnamed) which allowed me to gain purchase on what, until then, had been the “awful event” that people were hesitant to talk about. Talking about these crimes is/was the first step into opening eyes and ears and realizations that what we all believed was being done really was not. And, as you said, there are so many flags with Hastings that I watched come to light in real time. . . I was convinced and hopeful. When my views changed with new knowledge about the cases and Hastings was no longer the only suspect in my view, Helen turned. It was her narrative or nothing. I respected that about her. Her story and belief that Hastings was the killer never wavered and her pursuit of that created enemies in LE as well as her unwillingness to be open to anyone else who came forward with a different suspect which may have shut good people down. At least she spoke up.
I am wondering if maybe crowdsourcing for a substantial reward leading to the identification of the OCCK might help bring people with information out of their hiding places.
Money is not my motivation, I have a lot of tips I want justice and peace for the families, and Jill, Tim, Mark, and Kristine are staring down at me and know I have the true identity of the kidnapper, I am doing the best I can to get someone to listen, I don’t want money I want justice.
I said it before and I’ll say it again. Get that damn DNA made into a composite sketch! https://parabon-nanolabs.com/
Cathy. I just called the number. It went to a voice mail for Det Shawn Street. I couldn’t leave a tip because the mailbox was full!!!!!
Jessie
>
Great.
the voice mailbox is STILL full.
They better figure that out. This is just the beginning.
Cathy I certainly would never ask you to write about things that might be hurtful but I have to ask. I know your dad has talked about his conversations with Tim prior to his abduction … expressing to Tim the need to be extra careful.
Tim was obviously a bright kid. And your dad had spoken to him. Who would Tim trust enough to get in that car? Given your dad’s warnings wouldn’t he have made a scene?
All these kids vanished and if there was any commotion at all, no one seemed to notice.
You’d think if it was someone in a uniform, especially in Tim’s case where people saw him, that would have certainly been remembered. I can’t imagine a witness not recalling a policeman.
Could these kids have possibly known the perp? Would they have known anyone in common?
Someone dressed in a suit coat could have flashed a badge, said he saw Tim shoplifting and that they would have to clear it up at the police station. Or could have told him his parents were in a car wreck and he needed to come with him. Or he could have known the perp. John McKinney had dinner at the Coffey’s house, across the street from us, many times. Tim was over there all the time playing with one of the Coffey siblings. John Hastings was alleged to have been at a Tigers game Tim and other young kids from the neighborhood went to. We will probably never know the answer to this question. I did have two dreams soon after Tim was abducted. In one, Tim told me “I fell for it, Cath.” In the other, I had the most vivid dream that none of this had happened–that what did happen was just a nightmare. When I woke up, I was sweating. I was so relieved until I realized that the dream was a dream and our life now was the nightmare.
💔 😢
Your last sentence..broke my heart.
I have messaged the makers of the In The Dark Investigative Podcast asking them to cover the OCCK case. They have just released this update on a podcast they did involving the decades old case of Jacob Wetterling, with this header, “All of us failed; Law enforcement comes clean on botched Wetterling investigation” What I find worrisome about the update is that in the Jacob Wetterling case, once the case was solved, the records all became public. Given the level of cover up in the OCCK case, I wonder if the powers that be are purposely making sure the case is never solved so that they never have to release the records, and ultimately so that they can keep their secrets. Here is a linkto the Jacob Wetterling update. https://www.apmreports.org/story/2018/09/20/wetterling-investigation-documents.
Yes. Thank you Francis!
If, the OCPO has nothing to hide….then GD.it, open the entire file to the families of the victims and to the public. If after 40 years, they don’t, then I can only assume that they are trying to bury the details of the case or protect the political offices that they hold and that they are protecting high powered, rich, residents that may be implicated in the case.
YES.
Thanks Cathy for sending the phone number at this time no detective has called me at MSP, and this number you sent me the mailbox is full and you cannot leave a message or get to a live voice, I will keep trying, but they need to clear their box.
I am confident that all the people with information the puzzle pieces will fit together and the perfect picture will reveal all who were a part of the OCCK, being alive and being able to tell the identity has to mean something, there has to be a reason why I lived to tell about my attempted abduction by 98% sure was arch sloan.
Kids in heaven don’t give up, I told all of you I would not give up and I haven’t we are all doing what we can for all of you to have justice and your families to have peace.
I just called and the tip line (7:20 pm eastern) was receiving messages. Good thing, because after tonight there may be a lot more. Please try again–I know you won’t give up.
Hi Cathy,
I saw you last comment about how you were trying to figure out why Tim went with the kidnapper.
I want to make this as clear as I can the kidnapper drives up along you and then he tries to talk to you, he keeps riding next to you, then he turns the car closer and closer to you as you walk, then he does not even get out of the car he slowly stops the car and he grabs you arm and he pulls you to him, this is how the occk tried to kidnap me and another girl, there were two of us, and I held on and pulled and pulled and he got madder and madder and I gave it one more yank and we both fell to the ground.
If I would have had been alone or she would have been alone either one of us would have been in that car, as I pulled he pulled my arm and hers, I just kept pulling back not one child could pull away from him he was strong and knew exactly what he was doing, he thought we would be too weak, so none of the children who were murdered went to him, he made it so they had no where to run after he grabbed their arms through the side passenger door, I want all the families to know he was clever and he seemed really friendly, but I told the other girl don’t talk to him and put your head down, our Principal saved our lives, before we left school he said, “No child will walk alone, every child has to hold hands with another child we have a child killer in the area,”
Who would of thought in broad day light 20 min after the announcement we would have to fight for our lives against the occk.
Since I have gotten more determined to help in this case as much as I can, I thank you for that picture of arch sloan when he was younger, if I had never seen that I would not be as sure as I am that it was him, thanks for that I have a new found peace and gratitude he has been in prison since 1983.
Whoever these men are that were involved they know that 2 got away and we live to tell.
I hope that this will help the families a little bit, I don’t believe any of them willingly went with this man, he put them all in a position that they could not run.
People are out there wondering what they saw, was that him, what car and so many details, I and the other girl are the only ones that know for sure what he looks like.
Thank you, l.h. Thankfully your principal talked to all of you and thank god you got away. Arch Sloan is a monster. And thank you for the description of how he tried to trap you two.
Your welcome, I hope everyone has a better understanding he grabs from the passenger window, never gets out of the car, I guess he pulls them and throws them in the back seat, it never looked like he was going to open the door, he was trying to pull us through the window.
Just want all the families mind to rest that if you taught them not to go with strangers they didn’t and never had a chance to break away once he grabbed them.
I am so very sorry for all that your family has suffered throughout the years. I was a teenager living in Macomb County during this time and remember it well.
On October 30, 1967, my husband’s then 4-year-old brother was kidnapped out of his front yard and murdered by strangulation. This was in Royal Oak. The murderer was caught soon after; apparently a teenager and considered a juvenile thereby keeping his name out of the paper. For reasons that are lost to me, my husband, his siblings and my MIL do not remember his name. I don’t think i would ever forget it, but times were different back then. The story is that he was sent to a mental institution and released after a few years. In watching the documentary i cannot help but wonder who this person was and if there is any chance he was involved.
Again, my sincere condolences to you and yours. I pray that you and the family of the other victims get that one tip that will bring about the answer to this terrible mystery.
Nancy, sorry to hear about your husband’s brother. Glad that it was resolved, but few understand enduring tragedy like that. I wish him strength at this time.
I can only assume the task force had access to your his case, but we may not really know.
If you are able and willing to share more information about this, please do.
– name of the victim
– where abducted
– when/where found
– any information about the investigation
– any archival media coverage
This is the first I’ve heard of this case but the parallel is too important to overlook for anyone who has been working to piece this case together over 40 years with only limited access to information from law enforcement.
A teenager in 1967 is the same age as many of the suspects discussed here in 1977. The victim was much younger, but a murderer is a murderer.
His name was David Girardot. He was abducted from the neighbors yard on either Oct 30 or 31. Pretty sure it was the 30th. They lived on Windemere, one block off 13 mile and 2 blocks from Kimball High School. He was found in the woods a block away towards the school. I think there was an elementary school across the street as well. There are archived articles and his picture from the Detroit News and I believe the Oakland paper as well. Just cannot help but wonder if there was any connection.
Nancy, yes, I did find an article about it. (So sad). According to the article, it seems the suspect was caught almost immediately – a 15 yr old Kimball student. A very sick one.
You never how these things may link. It’s all worth consideration. Though it’s easy to assume this one is isolated, I always say, I’m no detective.
Thank you, again, for raising your voice about something unspeakable.
Yes, it is very sad. We have not talked about it for some time, but watching the documentary opened up a discussion. Again, times were different back in the 60s and 70s and information was not as available as today, especially if the perp was a juvenile and records were closed, but I do know (according to my MIL) that he was released after a few years, I just wish she remembered his name, but she is elderly and I do not want to open any wounds.
All the best, and I pray that the families of the OCCK get their answers in this lifetime.
The Kendall HS Royal Oak MI 1967 yearbook is available through Classmates.com. The Detroit Free Press article concerning David Girardot’s death stated the murderer was a freshman attending “special classes” at Kendall HS in ’67. If you had the time and interest to do so, you could compare the names of freshman in ’67 to those listed in the sophomore class of ’68. Any missing names in 1968 would give you a list of possible names of the evil bastard, since the he was locked up at that point. Too bad it wasn’t for the rest of his life.
I found an article from 1972 stating “The accused youth has been a patient in Pontiac State Hospital since the alleged murder and has been listed as mentally unable to stand trial.” https://newspaperarchive.com/benton-harbor-news-palladium-mar-31-1972-p-17/
Can’t find his name anywhere.
Thank you. We were kindly provided a name by another reader and yes, it was the person. The name immediately range a bell and was subsequently confirmed.
What was the name? Please let us know. Please.
It’s not my place to do so.
Nancy, can you email me at catherine.broad@yahoo.com? Someone provided some information you may find helpful.
Thank you, I did reply
THANK YOU, 7 IN 77!
Ms. Broad: My name is Robert Stacy McCain. I’m a journalist. I was watching the ID series about the OCCK case, decided to Google the names, — Gerald Richards, Grossman, etc. — and it brought me directly to your site. Feel free to email me at r.s.mccain@att.net.
Hi Cathy, has that Sebastian, the guy who saw Kristine getting into the cop car ever been polygraphed? Supposedly they indentified the cop, maybe this persons hairs would match up?
I’ve come to feel that the kidnapping of Jill and Kristine was for diversionary purposes. It may have been an attempt to throw off suspicion from the man/boy pedophile circles of the N Fox Island and Cass corridor perverts. Was it a conspiracy among them? Also the sketches of the OCCK looks very much like Greg Green in the early photo of him with long hair and without glasses. Does LE have a sample of Greg Green’s hair? Could this suspect be the donor of the unidentified hair samples? Could a sibling provide a sample? Could his body be exhumed if he wasn’t cremated. So many questions after seeing Children of the Snow. I hope more victims now come forward with their stories after the media attention. Cathy, I fervently hope you and your family get the answers they deserve, as well as the families of Mark, Jill, and Kristine.
Thank you! I believe a DNA sample was obtained from one of Green’s brothers.
I was upset with the way the documentary ended. Cory saying he’s giving up and all he has is mitochondrial DNA. I would say what pisses me off most is when they polygraphed lamborgine, Sloan, and Gunnels why wasnt this like a whole day event. I would have tested half the damn day obviously in intervals. I wouldn’t have gave them the results right away I would have said look it’s a automatated system I won’t know till after the interview.. Why wasn’t Gunnels asked if he knew or was associated with all the other suspects. I feel sorry for your family they screwed you guys over big time. Also as much as I don’t want to believe Gunnels. I hear your family saying the same thing how the state police and the task force play games and twist words. I mean they made this investigation hard to solve. Why they didnt go over the evidence back when DNA testing was discovered and relevant… I also saw a post a while ago saying that a state storage lab flooded that had DNA from this case there and everything was destroyed. WTF why after decades did they not test that DNA. It reminded me of when the state police discovered thousands of untested DNA related to rape and murder cases. This is just complete slop This whole investigation as a Michigander I am embarrassed. I bet money they know exactly who did it. I think they are afraid to say it because they know damn well your family could sue the shit out them and of course many corrupt individuals more than likely had their hands in the BUSCH family piggy bank over the years.
Cathy,
My heart goes out to your family. What a never ending nightmare. I am so sorry. I’ve had this sick feeling ever since watching the documentary on ID. I grew up in Alma and was 9 yrs old in 1977. I still have vivid memories to the day of when a large man with a beard approached my friend and I while we were riding our bikes home from school. He pulled off the road and yelled something thru the passenger window. My friend got off her bike and was going to see what he wanted when I screamed so loud she ran back to her bike and we rode as fast as we could to get away. I will never ever forget the look on this mans face and the sound of the gravel from his tires as he sped off. 40 years later and its burned into my memory. Alma was a small, friendly town and I never had any reason to be afraid of talking to people. Why I screamed like that was very out of character for me and thru the years have thought back on the experience and my reaction. I now know why, I had come face to face with pure evil. Again, I am so very sorry your family has had to endure such anguish. Thru your voices and diligent efforts I hope this case will be solved
I.H. & Cathy,
There are some discussions on Berkley’s Facebook groups about a guy in a car attempting to abduct kids in the area during the time of the OCCK. Terrifying! The ladies told their stories, all very similar. Some of them mention a large black car, and him following the kids down the street. The kidnapper opens the door and asks the kids if they want candy. One lady said she remembers walking to Anderson Middle School and being followed for three streets by the same car, and the license plate on the vehicle was covered with a plastic bag. Do you remember what kind of vehicle it was I.H.?
On another note, I shared your most recent post Cathy on the Berkley Facebook group sites which included the tip number and I also made people aware of her blog site by posting it. I also posted the recent link with the podcast of your dad speaking and encourage people to watch it. It got many “likes” so I hope word spreads and something unfolds. I always try to follow this case closely and I was thankful for the opportunity to post information on Facebook sites about it.
Lastly, I am so sorry for you and your family as well as the other victims families. I can’t imagine how this is eat’n all of you with frustration over the years. I certainly hope and pray that the truth comes out, specifically for your dad, and that serious justice is served for all involved.
Thank you, Tod. Tried to respond on my phone and it didn’t go. Glad you shared on the Berkley FB page. I have not seen that page. Not sure what the make of the car was. Numerous stories, however, about a big, black car. License plate covered with a plastic bag. That I have never heard, but it makes sense.
Todoricat,
I remember the car was a gremlin, and it was green not the dull blue they were looking for, either they painted it or it was reported wrong, it had the stripes on it that some of the gremlins had, but it is very possible that they had two guys out kidnapping children, I know that the guy that tried to get us, looks exactly like the young arch sloan he has the perfect triangle nose I remembered and the right color eyes after you stare him in the face for a while it is a face you can never forget, he drove up along us and asked, “How was your day at school girls.”
My friend I was holding hands with went to answer him and I told her no, just keep walking don’t talk to him, but he kept trying to talk to us as he turned the car closer and closer until he grabbed us, I am still in shock when I look back at it, through the passenger window he grabbed us, never got out of the car just leaned over and grabbed us, I guess him driving we were a little off guard, thinking he would have to get out of the car to get us, I believe in my heart that is how he got every single child, there were two of us, and trust me he almost had us both, I remember holding on to her but I could feel him pulling me in, but one more pull and we were free, I have said it once and will say it again, no one child would have gotten away from him.
Hi Tor,
Thanks for the Berkley group, I would love to chat with others who have had the same experiences, do I need to look for something specific or just join the group?
Thanks l.h,
Cathy, I watched the documentary the other night and tried to leave a comment, but it is not here. My family background is several generations of law enforcement, up to the highest levels. Back then the forensics were weak and it has always been nearly impossible to convict the wealthy and politically connected. As I watched, my thoughts were that one of the cops in this case took care of the problem. They had to think Bush and his partner did it, regardless of the polygraph. Righteous cops would have protected their community. Bush’s partner was going away forever, for the same offence others got a couple years. I am sure the judge knew he was more than just a molester.
Bush was getting off completely before his “suicide”. They “suicided” him and ended their task force shortly after, thinking the job was done. Interesting that the son of the cop who was friends with the one victim’s family, is the current investigator who has been stonewalling information for years. The other investigator was the son of the original lead. From the stories I know to be true of the way LE acted in those days, that is my impression. With up to 300 detectives on the case, at least one of them would have done the right thing.
At the very end of the show they said a cop told the guy at the uniform shop that the case was solved and Bush had done it. They knew and thought the threat was ended. The note “cleared” on the Bush file may not mean that they cleared Bush, it may be code to the future investigators that they “cleared” the case with the Bush “suicide”.
I do not mean to upset or offend in any way. This was just my instinctive reaction during the show, knowing my family’s stories from that era and the way I was raised to view our role in protecting society.
Thanks for reposting, John. Sorry about your previous comment–that seems to be happening the past few days. I think when I approve comments from my phone that it doesn’t always go smoothly.
My sympathy goes out to all of the victims families. I pray that these murders are solved soon.
Hopefully they are checking the DNA they have against Genealogy DNA like they did with the Golden State Killler and the killer of Linda Ann O’Keefe.
Cathy can you email me? Have a question that might help. Its a long shot but then everything is a long-shot 40 years out. Or let me know where I can email you.
catherine.broad@yahoo.com
Does anyone know anything about the piece of art taken from John Mckinney’s gallery the night of his murder? I’m curious about what it was and if it happened to be shaped like a diamond. Just a longshot thought about body placement and a potential connection.
Another random thought…I’ve read about unannounced visitors to Fox Island back in the day that remember running into a woman and a clearly uncomfortable young boy walking together. Has anyone ever identified this woman? Who was she and what part did she take, if any, in this nightmare?
And another…In regards to the letter sent to Danto from “Allen” – He requested the statement, “Weather Bureau Says Trees To Bloom In Three Weeks” be published in the Detroit Free Press. Out of desperation to find clues, I wonder if that requested statement was in fact a clue to prove his (Allen) involvement via knowledge of intricate details. Jill was found with an inserted tampon…maybe the “trees to bloom in 3 weeks” was referring to her cycle. Weird thought, I know, but this whole case is weird.
Forgive me, I have more thoughts and questions. This case has consumed my mind! – There are so many different writings that have me confused about the actual facts. I’ve read that the boys were tortured and raped, that they were raped, but only with objects and not human body parts, that they were raped with objects, but only after death, that the girls were not molested, that the girls were molested orally, and on and on. What is the truth? To me, that would completely alter the direction to look as far as perps go. One day I’m almost set on who fits, then I read another report with different details. Ugh!
– Also in Allen’s letter, he says “Frank” drove a Gremlin. Isn’t the entire Gremlin thing a total miss? If so, that could throw Allen out completely.
– Who was the Cop that submitted the “LeMans” lead incorrectly? Perhaps it was intentional for obvious reasons.
– And, the witness who saw Timmy talking with the man with shaggy hair by the Gremlin, said he was dark skinned. Since it was March in Michigan, he was either naturally dark-skinned or just got in from a sunny place that gave him a tan. Strangely enough, that psycho Edward Wayne Edwards supposedly had just gotten in from California and looks just like the first sketch drawn.
– Why do the sketches all look completely different? The first shows a blonde haired man, the others, a dark haired man…are they from different witnesses?
Sheri,
I can see you passion about this case, and I know there are so many questions that seem to not be able to be answered properly, I really don’t know where the first report of the blue gremlin was, but I live to tell that it was a green gremlin forsure, and the one that tried to kidnap us was arch sloan, I reviewed all the pictures of all the suspects and he is the only one that fits the description of the man that tried to kidnap me and another girl we were 11 years old, I have no idea how to get anyone to listen to me, but I am trying ,I lived out of the states most of my life and never thought the occk was never caught.
Whoever the witness was that saw the man near Tim with the shaggy hair, I truly don’t believe this is the way the occk worked, he was clever and wanted children alone on a road, I don’t believe he would sit at any store and wait, He would be near a store and watching for a child to walk alone, but not where someone would see him, I have no idea where he must have been sitting when he tried to get us, he came from out of no where.
I have to accept that two girls got away from him and now we are stuck with the information that goes no where, talk about consumed, I have dreamed about it since I have tried to get someone to listen to me, I refuse to be a prisoner of his face in my face and holding my arms, I will accept that his day will come, all of their days will come that were involved, and it is very possible that there were two kidnappers, the descriptions are so different, ours had short blonde hair and very clean cut, nothing like the the long hair shaggy one, I wish I could ease your mind about all the questions I can only say the one that tried to get me, is arch sloan, if Cathy had never posted a younger arch sloan I would have dismissed the entire suspects on file, her picture showed me the man I remembered and that perfect triangle nose, a child remembers details as a child does, I remember the triangle nose, the light blue eyes, not bushy eyebrows and slender build, and the green color, not blue, will anyone listen probably not.
I have all the same questions you have, and I guess we will both just have to wait until someone answers all of them,
I found it strange about the girls being kidnapped but they liked boys, I guess they wanted to keep the police wondering, however there next attempt was 2 girls it was me and my friend, who knows the reasoning of pedaphile sicko freak.
North Fox island has EVERYTHING to do with it.
The Detroit Police were INVOLVED (and made tons of illegal money aiding these pedophiles with “at risk”, “ runaway” ( but really drugged, kidnapped or lured homeless (sometimes paid) children, porn, drugs seized in illegal raids, unaccounted for, them sold to them and used to drug children with) as were many high ranking politicians, businessmen, and well known individuals. They worked together.
Who would believe a child over a cop?
And those that did were too afraid of ending up dead to come forward or speak out.
And I know because I KNOW!)
Nobody wants to go there. The men who frequented Fox Island are the worst kind of human beings and to add insult to injury, they have been protected all these decades. Would LOVE to get a hold of an unreacted version of Gerald Richard’s “client list.” And of course Detroit PD was involved. I have no doubt of that. Dirty cops–possibly worse than the monied pedophile freaks.
My mom believes she has information on this case and has left messages on the tip lines, but never heard back.
Don’t waste you time calling the tip lines, contacting the MSP or the Oakland County sheriff. Call the office of Wayne County Prosecutor Kym Worthy and ask to speak with Inspector Bivens.